Ayahuasca Podcast

In this episode of AyahuascaPodcast.com, host Sam Believ has a conversation with Tracey Tee, founder of Moms on Mushrooms (M.O.M.). We touch upon subjects such as microdosing for mothers, postpartum depression, quitting antidepressants using microdosing, and more.

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[00:00:00] Sam Believ: You're listening to ayahuasca podcast.com.

In this episode of ayahuasca podcast.com, we talk about mushroom microdosing. Specifically for mothers, we talk about. stigma that's attached to mothers or parents working with psychedelics or entheogens. We talk about cultural shift that's needed for this not to be the case and we also talk about using mushrooms to quit antidepressants and so so much more.

It's a great episode. I'm sure you will enjoy it. Remember to leave us a review, whatever you're listening to this podcast, and leave us a or share it with a friend. The world deserves to know we're going through a mental health crisis and those plant medicines can really help. And this episode is sponsored by LaWyra Ayahuasca Retreat.

Hi guys, and welcome to ayahuascapodcast. com as always with you, the hosts and believe today we're going to have a guest Tracey Tee. Tracey is, um, from trees of honor of moms and mushrooms where she talks about everything regarding microdosing for moms and then so much more. I'm very excited for this episode.

Tracey. Welcome. 

[00:01:18] Tracey Tee: Thank you. Thank you for having me. 

[00:01:20] Sam Believ: Tracey, tell us a little bit about yourself and what made you work with micro dosing with mushrooms and specifically with moms. 

[00:01:29] Tracey Tee: Thank you. Yeah. I am a mom. I have a 13 year old daughter. I live in Denver, Colorado. I've been married for almost 22 years.

And I am a late in life. Thank you. Psychonaut. I came to mushrooms in my mid forties after losing a business that actually was also working with moms actually had a live comedy show that was a comedy show for mothers about laughing about all the things we have in common as moms. So I've been in the mom world for ever since I've been a mom actually professionally.

And when I started working with this medicine to. Yeah. Not only heal some grief, but continue my own spiritual journey. What became abundantly clear was that this, I believe this medicine has presented itself on the planet in this time in history. Not specifically for moms, but for moms.

For sure. Because it's such a gentle heart opening reconnector and I believe that the mental health of mothers, especially modern Western mothers is in a place where it's not sustainable. We are in a critical period and moms are deeply unhappy. Deeply over medicated deeply depressed and we're raising Children and we are at a critical point of how we take care of the generations that we're raising.

And I think this medicine is here to help. For me micro dosing felt like the perfect step to bring moms back together and to reinstall that sense of community that I think our modern Western culture is really missing. Mushrooms require that of the people. It is a web. They want it wants to be taken and worked with in community.

And I also believe that micro dosing specifically for moms, especially in the West in the US where I'm living we aren't. We don't have a culture that has any sense of appreciation for ceremony or sacredness. And any kind of connection, continuous connection to nature. That's not like a novel.

Oh, look at me. I'm going to take a picture of myself out in the forest type thing, but a true connection to ceremony and what it means to actually sacredly heal. So I believe that. Microdosing first allows a mother to understand what entheogenic medicine feels like in her body and create a relationship for it.

Because what my concern is as this psychedelic renaissance continues to grow, the enthusiasm. Makes people go out and seek out the largest, biggest, strongest, most expansive journey they can find. And that can actually be incredibly destabilizing. So this is a way to gently introduce the medicine to mothers so that you can go and pursue a large dose journey and feel safe and empowered and actually have a relationship with the medicine.

And that's what Moms on Mushrooms is about. 

[00:04:26] Sam Believ: It's beautiful. I'm I'm really identifying with many things you say, the fact that you work with mothers and humor. I think we're too serious these days and the healing will come from playfulness. And you probably know mushrooms mushrooms do that a lot.

And, serving moms as well. It's a very unserved population. And I love you being on that quest about spreading information because yeah, the world deserves to know that. It's a medicine and that psychedelics can be extremely helpful. I want to tell you about my personal story and why I was so compelled to interview is so I have a wife.

We started the wire together, which is an I was great treat. And, of course, when you We have two kids and she's pregnant again now with the third one. So I completely agree with your task. And when after a second son was born, she was acting very strange. She was being negative about lots of things.

And I asked myself, everything she talks about. It's actually pretty good. The situation was pretty good. So I didn't understand why she was negative. Of course, because I already worked in this field a little bit, I thought, okay, maybe she's depressed. And then I remembered about listening to podcast, I believe, as well as something about postpartum depression.

And it all came together. So I went to the freezer where I had some mushrooms. I took a microdose and I gave it to her. And she accepted it, obviously, because We work in this field. And about a few weeks later, she started to feel better. And it was pretty clear. Of course, as you say in your content, post depression doesn't just go away immediately, but it really eased her pain and it got much better.

Talk to us a little bit about why microdosing is so perfect for moms specifically. And maybe if tell us a little bit about postpartum depression. 

[00:06:16] Tracey Tee: Sure, microdosing. First of all, okay, if we reframe, all right, how do we start with this? If we look at a mother in distress or a mother who is depressed or a mother who is in need of help, okay, mental health help, however, that looks our traditional models are.

Traditional psychology, which is going to an office, sit down, talk about the thing, maybe talk about it some more. And then eventually, truly the common thing is you're unhappy or you're sad. So we're going to make you unsad or less sad with this pill. And what happens is that nothing is actually healed.

Nothing is cleared out from the body or from the heart. And the mom is. In put inside a loop where she is in both ways. If she's going to therapy, oftentimes re traumatizing herself by talking over and over about the thing that's bothering her with no resolve. And then at the same time. Is having a numbed out experience where she's not actually connected to her deep emotions.

And isn't her body isn't chemically allowing her emotions to come to the surface to release the trauma of which she speaks. So that is a very generalization of the mental health of mothers and how moms traditionally go in and seek out mental health, microdosing. Is the exact opposite microdosing is a real like punch in the throat, frankly, of medicine that comes, that brings all of your feelings up to the surface.

And I believe it connects your heart and your mind and your body so that all 3 things are speaking to each other and hearing each other, which means when you're, I believe that microdosing, it helps. You feel and become more embodied, so you're feeling aches and pains and fatigue and overwhelm in your body more acutely, and your brain is finally hearing your body.

Tell your brain. You need to slow down. You're not okay. This is something that needs to be addressed. And at the same time, micro dosing allows those feelings to come up or those problems. And you stare at it, it stares at you and you recognize it and you acknowledge it for what it is. And then I believe that the medicine can just from that acknowledgement point, turns into butterflies and flies away and it doesn't go back down inside you.

And so it's a very gentle way to actually fully holistically heal something that is bothering a mother. On top of that, large dose journeys are amazing. As you well know, and ayahuasca is amazing, but moms don't necessarily have the time it takes to devote to a truly integrated, like, Purposeful preparation period and then going into doing a large dose journey.

And then a lot of times moms don't have the time to integrate afterwards. Our healing is done in between school and making snacks and wiping butts and giving baths and driving to doctor's appointments. We don't have long. spans of hours in a day or over a weekend to devote to ourselves. And I'm not saying that sarcastically, I wish we did, but when you take on the role of a parent, that is your number one priority is raising tiny humans.

So weaving in psychedelic medicine is absolutely possible, but it just takes a different approach than what is traditionally presented out in the psychedelic. space. And microdosing is just a gentler, slower, smaller way to heal incrementally in a timeframe that actually works for a mother because you're not high and you can do those things.

You can heal on the, car ride back from school. You have some space there and the medicine is working with you. So that's that's really why I think this is so important and potent for mothers. In terms of Postpartum, there's actually so little research, actual research done about postpartum depression.

What is triggering it? And what actually will help it? What we've done is we've just taken a medication model, which is she looks like she's in happier and distress. So we're just going to give her. an antidepressant and there's no exit strategy and there's no actual support that comes in and holds the mother where she's at.

Your story about seeing your wife feeling concern, offering some medicine and saying I know that something's wrong and, holding her to help. Is the right way. And sometimes we just need that community to come around a mom who, whose body and hormones are in massively rewiring, patterns and hold space for her, nourish her, give her food, give her rest, give her the help she needs.

And then. Let's take a look at her hormones and her deeper mental health, and I think that microdosing can really help support that because it's not going to interfere with anything else. And it's going to allow her to feel her grief and her pain if she's experiencing that postpartum while releasing it so that it doesn't stick with her for years to come.

[00:11:36] Sam Believ: That's a great explanation. I think you spoke about it on the other interview you did. But can you tell us about why, moms, especially Soon after birth why is it such a priority for them to feel good? 

[00:11:53] Tracey Tee: I just think that is programming that we've accepted over many generations.

I think culturally there is little tolerance for a woman who is hysterical, right? Hysteria. And we used to, that's what, Menzies used to be called, your hysterical period. And traditionally in a patriarchal society, we don't like women who are sad. We don't like women who are angry.

We don't like women who are depressed who are grieving. And there has been this. Just expectation of when a woman has a baby that she has about six weeks to bounce back and fix everything. And that's like your grace period. But even then you're, a lot of women go back to work even before that time, or you're, you've got other kids at home that you're raising and you're just expected to get over.

This monumental thing that you just went through and carry on as if nothing happened. And the truth is, again, going back to just research and understanding female physiology, we don't really even address the massive physical changes that happen to a woman when she gives birth. And we definitely don't from an allopathic way.

Say, okay, here's your course back to care. After you had a baby, we're going to, we're going to monitor your hormones. We're going to monitor your blood sugar levels. We're going to monitor your adrenals and we're going to give you supplements and we're going to give you the support and nutritional aspect you need.

So that your rebalance none of that happens. And it just leads to hysterical women. And we just don't have a society right now that. Okay. Concerns itself over an unhappy mother. 

[00:13:37] Sam Believ: Yeah, hopefully that improves and especially when the baby is just born. If a mother is depressed, then the baby will have attachment issues.

And then you, it keeps going, let's say. If a baby is a girl, then it keeps going for a generation and just keeps accumulating and we need something to break that pattern. Uh, Tracey, why did you choose mushrooms specifically for helping mothers? 

[00:14:03] Tracey Tee: I would just say mushrooms chose me.

Hey I didn't really have. Much say in the matter. Honestly, as I look back on the path of my life mushrooms just came into play. It's something I've always loved. I've always loved plants and have studied herbology and herbal medicine for years, decades and mushrooms would always come up and I've always been fascinated by the healing.

Like powers of magic mushrooms. But again, as a mom, I just was like there's none of that is for me. And actually, to be perfectly honest, I was mostly interested in ayahuasca when I started to research psychedelic medicine. And then for some reason, the mushrooms just came in hot and just showed up in my front door one day.

And the minute I worked with mushrooms for the first time, it's A grand knowing, just a light bulb went on inside my soul and I just knew that they were my master teacher. I always joke, I was 1 journey early on. I was with my mentor and I was on the floor, of course, like weeping and I looked up at her and I said, I think I'm just put on this earth to eat mushrooms and that's just how I feel.

I just think they're just, they were just presented as my master plan teacher. 

[00:15:17] Sam Believ: Yeah, I really identify with that because people ask me like, how did you end up doing this? And I was like all I did was the work direction was set by something else. And just as in your journey, just synchronicities happen and you get guided.

So I think I do believe that certain people have are put on this path because the world needs it. And so you mentioned that you were I'm a big fan of mushrooms and ayahuasca as well. But obviously we ended up working with ayahuasca also for legal reasons, because in Colombia, ayahuasca is legal and mushrooms are in a gray zone.

But both medicines are very beautiful. And, I believe that combining two, not together in the same ceremony, but let's say in between your ayahuasca retreats, cause it's hard, to go and do that. Mushrooms can reconnect you to that state. And it's a beautiful combination. It's like a ayahuasca is a grandmother and mushrooms are grandchildren.

And it's a family in the end of the day. So you said you felt calling for ayahuasca first and then obviously it's difficult for a mother to, get out of life and dedicate long term, long time for Ayahuasca. So did you end up doing Ayahuasca in the future? Or, and or not?

[00:16:28] Tracey Tee: No, I haven't done it yet. I think one thing that I've been, that I've learned is. And I always say that I'm like raised by medicine women and this path, my path is very much the slow medicine medicine woman way. So those are my mentors. And even though I'm a type a triple Aries manifesting generator who likes to get stuff done really fast, I know that my teacher for ayahuasca will present.

Itself themselves when it in the time will open itself up. And I wanted to speak to that, especially for ayahuasca because I, I've obviously have hundreds of conversations with women who have done it, who want to do it. But I also, and it is a little bit more of a time constraint for people and for mothers.

But I think as this. As this space grows, and as we raise awareness around using entheo medicines for healing and theogenic medicines for healing my prayer is that as a culture, we start to make room for each other to go and do these things without judgment and with support so that when someone says, when a girlfriend says, or a wife says to her husband, I'm feeling called to do ayahuasca, the husband knows, because this is the shift in our culture.

Yes. All right. Let's make this happen for you and not Oh my God. And it's so much money and it's this and it's that, but You feel it. This is important to you. It's important for me. Let's do it. And I really hope that changes over time. But yeah, as far as the relationship between mushrooms and ayahuasca, you're right.

And also, I don't think we talk a lot about in the space that I really believe that microdosing is such a beautiful way to integrate after a large dose journey. So you have that ayahuasca experience and then you can come home and you can microdose of the mushrooms and stay with. the grandmother and really learn and integrate those lessons.

I think a lot easier and more gently with the help of a low dose of another medicine. 

[00:18:20] Sam Believ: Definitely. Yeah. I was can mushrooms is a match made in heaven. Yeah. And I love what you say about the cultural shift because my personal dream is and Partially why I'm doing this podcast right now is to go from a point of what is ayahuasca to the point of to the conversation starter where when's the last time you did ayahuasca and hopefully, 

[00:18:41] Music: hopefully 

[00:18:41] Sam Believ: we get there.

And what you talk about stigma is definitely true. When you, if people think that ayahuasca or mushrooms is a schedule one drug, and then obviously a mother doing ayahuasca or mushrooms is very stigmatized. We definitely need to. To change that. You know what, Tracey? Um, uh, you know how synchronicities happen and you get calling for Alaska.

I consider sometimes myself to be the messenger for that call. So I would like to use that chance to extend an invitation for you to come to the retreat totally free of charge some. When you're ready and maybe we'll do next episode in person and after you finally do your Alaska experience So and I definitely because I am a father myself and my wife she works with us.

Obviously, there are certain Traditional ceremony rules and how and when and which month and stuff like that, but I do We do welcome mothers when they want to come with children Obviously, the problem is who's going to take care of the child. So in that case, what we normally do, we ask a couple to come together and bring a kid with them.

Then they have a private accommodation. And what they do is one day the husband drinks another day, the wife drinks and in between they take care of the child together. And this seems to be working. I think it's a good solution for those who do want to. to try ayahuasca. So Tracey, I know, for example, in a tradition here in Colombia with ayahuasca, women are allowed to drink on certain months of pregnancy.

It also comes with postpartum. What about mushrooms? When is it safe to take mushrooms in the microdose form? Can Pregnant women take mushrooms. Can women that are breastfeeding take mushrooms? What is your take on that? 

[00:20:38] Tracey Tee: Obviously the jury is out from a scientific standpoint. There is not enough research.

I don't have a take because i'm not a doctor, but I will say that In terms of toxicity, and this is what I've spoken to with scientists is if you are taking an SSRI while you're pregnant, and they're not concerned about it crossing the blood brain barrier, you can assume that psilocybin. will act in a similar manner.

And so that is a really very basic, but simple analogy that makes sense to me. I also believe that if you are in distress and you are having a hard time with your pregnancy and it is actually compromising how you are growing that baby and showing up as a mother, With the baby in your belly, then, and if mushrooms feel like the answer, I think that a woman, a mother's intuition, if you're actually listening to it may not be wrong.

And then I look back at traditional cultures, like you're saying, I look back at what the original peoples have done for centuries around pregnancy and especially postpartum and breastfeeding. And I look at the stories of the medicine women who have done it and how their children and even grandchildren have turned out and how wonderful and almost magical they are.

I just take an agnostic view and I don't take an agnostic view. I take a intuition view. I think that answer is between you and God. And I think that if it feels like the right thing, I think you probably are called to do it. 

[00:22:13] Sam Believ: Mhm. Tracey, I can imagine you work with hundreds, if not thousands of mothers for the mothers that might be listening to this episode.

You know what kind of results? Can can they expect to, to get, what are success stories you maybe want to share? 

[00:22:31] Tracey Tee: Yeah, thank you. And I also just want to say to that point a friend of mine Michaela Delamico is almost dedicated her life to this discussion of mushrooms and motherhood in utero and in breastfeeding.

And she's a great. Resource. She's working on a project called mothers of the mushroom and she's written papers about it and has a beautiful community. And I encourage anyone listening to this to look up. I think our handles mama de la micro on Instagram and she's a great resource. So I always also defer to her.

But for me, the women who come to us, and we really specialize in women postpartum and we've had. Women go through our courses as early as four weeks postpartum and breastfeeding. So it's very common in our community. I think the number 1 thing that women come to moms on mushrooms for is to get off 1, if not several medications, they feel like they're on a treadmill of antidepressants.

It's ADHD medication, sleep medications, and they don't know how to get off that treadmill. And so their soul is seeking a simpler, gentler way. The second thing that women usually come to us is just simple presence. They have a desire to be present with their children. I think collectively we're feeling the overwhelm of this technological culture of being connected to our phones, our computers and the distractions that are happening and our attention spans are shortening, which makes it actually physically and mentally more difficult to like, hang out with a 2 year old.

Because we're not, we're so used to being distracted and moving on to the next thing and kids actually move quite slow, right? When they get into something, they want to stay there for quite a long time. And that's not where we're at. So women really find that microdosing helps them drop in. It helps soften the go go, and those charged edges.

And really just find joy in the simple presence of just. Hanging out with your kid. And then the third thing is reactivity, which kind of goes with it. Just, very, I don't think any mom likes yelling at her kids, right? We know we have abusive parents in the world and that's its own thing, but generally speaking, most mothers really just wanna be the best moms they can.

And the shame that's associated when you don't show up is the best. put you into a spiral. And women really just want to be gentler with their children. They don't want to be as triggered by their kids. They don't want to yell at their kids. They want to find a language of commonality and the ones who work and really work to create an intentional microdosing practice through our program or someone else's find that the medicine is really supportive and just making you the mother that you want to be.

And so it really, at the end has nothing to do. with you and everything to do with you. But so much to do. It's really a lot of women and moms and mushrooms just are doing it for their kids. 

[00:25:23] Sam Believ: I just had a question and it's a little selfish. What about the fathers? Should they take my food? 

[00:25:31] Tracey Tee: Okay. First of all, dad's on mushrooms is coming.

So that is definitely on our list. I think if I say over and over that mothers are in distress and the mental health of mothers is concerning, I think we have the same issue with fathers. And I think the men who are wanting to step up in this day and age and really show up for their families and for their partners Have very little support.

I think there's actually much more support female woman to woman, female to female right now than there is man to man and certainly father to father, we're seeing a rise of like younger generations of men who are young and maybe considering starting a family and single who are working with this medicine and finding great healing, but just good old fashioned dads who just want to do right by their family.

There's not a lot. So we're hoping to come and fill that gap. Yeah. But I think, the family that microdoses together probably stays together because you are going to be connected on a deeper heart level. And it just makes those hard conversations, which happen in every relationship, easier to alchemize.

And one thing that I think I always find myself so grateful to mushrooms for is. Is the lessons that I am always learning. So before if something went wrong, I think I would slip into more of a victim hood or bitter and just angry that I'm that I'm, that my schedule is messed up or that I'm.

just irritated. And now if something bad happens, whether that's a car accident or a death in the family or money or any number of things, life things, I find myself moving towards the lessons and finding gratitude in that moment because I feel myself growing. And that is for sure from the medicine. So when a couple does that together, when a father can do that Gosh, magic, 

[00:27:17] Sam Believ: beautiful.

As you say, if they microdose together, they probably stay together. I say the same thing. The couples that drink together, and I'm talking about ayahuasca stay together because if let's say a mom starts microdosing. She will slowly also start growing spiritually and mentally and eventually she might feel herself a bit separate from her husband because she he wasn't growing.

So it should be done together. I get right now all sorts of ideas coming about how to organize moms and dads. I was going to treat. So we will talk about it later. Maybe we can partner up. I know you boom. I saw some videos of you like going on the news talking about micro dosing and stuff.

How does it get received? Do you get ridiculed? Do people listen? What's the reaction when you talk about those topics? 

[00:28:10] Tracey Tee: I have to say of all the news I've been so fortunate to have discussions about or go on. I would say 99. 5 percent of all the responses have been overwhelmingly positive. We really don't get a lot of negative feedback.

I credit that to my relationship with God. The prayers I said before I started this company before I accepted this mission, really is probably a better way to say it. And I think it also is a credit to our culture, to our society right now, who is hungry for change. And when someone speaks and relates to a normal mom or dad, however, that looks and you feel like those words might be yours.

There just isn't a lot of reason to ridicule and anything that we have gotten that's negative has truly just been from a place of misinformation. It's just people who have bought into the misinformation that our government governments collectively has siphoned to the public for. 50, 60, 2000 years and and they've just decided to believe it.

So it's coming from a place of ignorance and fear. And it's just hard to get upset about that because it's just, you just don't know the facts, but I'm really lucky to have a lot of support wherever I go. 

[00:29:31] Sam Believ: Yeah, I think the society is getting more and more ready to receive this message and and understand that.

Maybe desperate enough with the mental health crisis that's that is going on. Uh, Tracey, I'm curious, let's say somebody who listens to this episode they they like your message and they want to learn about your program. Can you talk about them? How does it look like?

What more or less, sum up, what is the, what does the program look like? 

[00:29:58] Tracey Tee: Sure. Yeah, we have three buckets. Our first one is our private community membership. So I have a beautiful portal with thousands of mothers. That's completely off social media. And we have a private membership.

It's only 2 and 22 cents a month. So ridiculously affordable. And it's literally like Facebook for moms on shrooms. And that is the place where we invite mothers who are seasoned psychonauts and have been working with entheogenic medicine forever and have never really felt like they had a community or mothers who are curious, but still may be terrified, just want to learn more, but don't want to Google ayahuasca or psilocybin or follow a hashtag, which we know is a terrible idea.

They can come and just learn from each other. And it's just a constant conversation of mothers talking about. their own experiences with this medicine, along with tons and tons of resources for women to, for mothers to empower themselves. So that's like the first bucket. The second bucket are longer courses.

We have a three and a half month, get started microdosing course. That's really for the mom. When she's ready, we believe it takes about three months to feel that medicine working in your body to unlearn some of the things that you believe not only about. psychedelics, but about how medicine works, on unlearn the allopathic role and allow yourself to go through a few cycles of feelings.

And those are held in containers of 10 women or less. So they're super intimate. And you're really supported from day one as you create an intentional practice, because the truth is that in the end of the day, microdosing is like not really rocket science. It's the intention behind it and the why behind why anyone does works with plant medicine is the important thing.

And it's actually a lot harder to establish than you might think. And then we have we have 8 week courses that come out throughout the year that are like, shorter and condensed and focused around essential things. theme. So for example, right now, I'm about to launch one in mid February. That's called motherhood microdosing and magnetism.

And it's all about unblocking the throat chakra. So we roll those out a few times a year and then we have just some really great basic one on one courses. We have microdosing one on one for moms and macrodosing one on one for moms. And that is just a, the how, the why, the what the heck is this all through the lens of a mom.

And how she would want to enjoy that information. And those are instant downloads. You can read it on the airplane in the middle of the night while you're breastfeeding. Easy course, packed full of information and resources. And that's really just my mission. Like I said earlier, it's just to educate and empower women.

And I think we have to learn about this medicine before we start working with it. So that we have a full 360 degree relationship with it. So that's really what we do. 

[00:32:49] Sam Believ: Tracey, um, interesting question. I'm very curious. You don't, you not only do micro dosing, you also do micro dosing. Can you share maybe the most profound experience or most crazy experience you've had on mushrooms?

[00:33:07] Tracey Tee: Oh, gosh, there's so many. Gosh. Oh, I'm like, which one do I tell? I'll share a short story. I went to an Airbnb in the mountains of Colorado cause I was writing and I just needed to get away and I brought medicine with me, just as maybe I'll do it. But I wasn't really planning on it. And that morning I had gotten up, I had made a really nice breakfast and I was just hanging out in the kitchen by myself.

And I'm not one who feels her guides come in outside of the medicine space very frequently, but it was like my every, my entire galactic team just showed up at the breakfast table and they were like you're doing medicine today. You won't be writing. You're taking the medicine. And I was just like, yeah, no way.

There's no way. I don't have the time. I've got to go home tomorrow. I have all these things to do. And the messages were just so insistent. Like this, it's, this is what you're doing. You need to walk the walk. You need to get clear on some things. And I remember like in the kitchen, I said out loud, I go I just had breakfast and they didn't seem to care.

And so I heeded the call and that was 1 of the 1st times I had done the medicine unguided and done it by myself and poured it into. Put some mushrooms into some cacao and went on a walk and ended up going out into the forest in January in Colorado and bundled up and essentially laid on the cold, hard ground surrounded by snow and had like my first official sort of initiation.

And it was during that journey where I was really asked, are you ready to follow this path? Like truly, are you ready to serve? Like you say you are. And it was this massive Massive questioning and initiation is the best word where I really had to get honest with myself about, is this what I want to do probably for the rest of my life?

And I will tell you that I wasn't sure for quite a while. Felt like hours. I cried. I asked questions. I cursed. And then I finally said yes. And the minute I said, yes, it was like I was transported through this portal. And and so many lessons from that day have come out to play over the past year.

And it was really beautiful. There's more to say about that, but that's like a two hour podcast interview. So 

[00:35:22] Sam Believ: that's that sounds very familiar. It's really hard to explain a psychedelic experience with Human words, they're just not enough. When you said you lie, lay down on the ground it reminded me of an experience I had about.

Six months ago. Obviously when we work with ayahuasca, I personally drink ayahuasca once a month, but sometimes I can't for Reasons of business and there was this rough period I was going through emotionally in between two retreats So I thought I'm gonna go get a microdose and I didn't really measure it I think I ended up taking like a gram what luckily it's not and I'm very sensitive to all the medicines including ayahuasca Luckily, 

[00:36:02] Tracey Tee: me too.

Oh my gosh. I'm so sensitive. 

[00:36:05] Sam Believ: Maybe people who are on that mission are extra sensitive because medicines. No, like we need to get into it. And I also felt the desire to lie on the ground. Luckily. So here in Columbia, it's always warm and it was on the grass, not in the snow. And I was just, Yeah, just rolling around and crying and, just releasing emotions.

It was really nice very difficult, but also I felt really nice. So yeah, it's a, there's a billion other things that's happening, but that's the kind of description you can give. Yeah, I, so as we work with ayahuasca exclusively. We're not allowed to serve mushrooms here in Columbia, at least for now.

But I do, oftentimes, when people want to come to do ayahuasca, they need to stop taking antidepressants. And a lot of times I recommend them to use mushrooms and microdosing to help with that. Obviously, I'm no expert on mushrooms, and I know a lot of mothers might also be on antidepressants and other medications.

And so Would you, and of course not a medical advice, just from point of view of personal experience what do you think? Could it be a good way of doing it? 

[00:37:16] Tracey Tee: Yeah, we've seen a lot of women have a lot of success on following a very strict and methodical titration protocol. And I absolutely recommend that there's some amazing pharmacologists out there that have you know Ben Malcolm, the spirit pharmacist, Emily Culpa, who are.

who have dedicated their path to the intersection of pharmaceuticals and psychedelics. And so I recommend anyone who wants to titrate down to consult with someone like that, unless you're, God willing, your doctor actually understands it and work on a slow titration protocol to take yourself off because it can be very destabilizing to just quit SSRIs cold turkey.

And microdosing. Can kind of swoop in and fill in those spaces to make the side effects a lot less. And we've seen that time and time again, where you're not necessarily feeling some of the larger, more profound effects of microdosing because an SSRI can typically blunt the effects of psilocybin.

But it really is coming in as like this nice cozy, cuddly little helper as you titrate off. And Still allowing in in real time, allowing you to rewire your neural pathways as your body detoxes from the SSRI. So I think it can be done well. And I, and we have seen great results. I just think it has to be done carefully and, you have to have some patience. It's not like I want to start microdosing and I want to stop my Zoloft and I want to do it this week. It doesn't work like that. And as and I know all of this medicine is slow and so giving yourself time and that's why our foundational course is 3 and a half months because it does take time, especially if you've been on an SSRI for a long time, you're going to feel really different and it's going to be very unfamiliar territory.

To you when you titrate off and that's where microdosing can come in and support for sure. 

[00:39:08] Sam Believ: Thank you, Tracey. Well, um, it's been a great episode. I know you're a busy mom and you have to run. Before we finish any last recommendations for people and where can people find you and.

Moms that are listening, where can they sign up for your program? 

[00:39:24] Tracey Tee: Thank you. You can just go to moms on mushrooms. com. All of our information is there. I have a love hate relationship with social, but if you want to follow us on Instagram, we're at moms on mushrooms official, but I really encourage every mother who's listening to join the grow, which is our private community membership, 2 and 22 cents a month.

Just come in and join our community and. relearn what it feels like to just talk to other moms without an expert at the helm. There's no, it's certainly not me. There's no guru or some right or dogmatic way to do things. It's just conversations. And I believe that's what the medicine is asking. And in terms of advice, I would just say.

To anyone who's thinking about working with any plant medicine, know your why, get real clear on why you want to do it. It may be something that you just want to experience, but if you're feeling like you're feeling pressured from friends or family who have had these transformational experiences, if you feel like you're at your last rope, and this, this is the only thing that's going to fix you.

I would just sit a moment longer and really understand your why and get clear. And then after, your why ask yourself. Am I actually ready to change because the whether it's mushrooms or ayahuasca or a boga or peyote or any number of entheogens, you will be asked to change the things about yourself that are no longer working.

And if you're not willing to do that, you can drink all the ayahuasca on the planet and it's never going to, it's never going to help. So just be ready for change. And if it takes crying on a forest floor for five hours to do it, so be it. But change is the big. Changes the big equation. 

Thank you, Tracey.

[00:41:05] Sam Believ: And hopefully that's not the last episode we do and then the next one we'll talk about mothers on ayahuasca 

[00:41:14] Tracey Tee: Absolutely, I would love to 

[00:41:15] Sam Believ: guys. Thank you for listening and I will see you in the next episode guys I hope you enjoyed this episode if you like our podcast and would like to support us and psychedelic revolution at large Please follow us and leave a like whenever you're listening to this podcast.

Nothing in this podcast is medical advice. It's intended for educational purposes only.